Strange bedfellows...

[witzend]

So, you may all remember that L has been really rude to us lately, moreso than ever. I gave her a quick text at work last week confirming a phone number that I had transposed. It took a couple of messages to figure out. She called me and started screaming "I'm busy! I can't talk now, but you did this and that and you should have done that and this!" Me, "I don't think so, let me check." "Yes you did!" I said "If you can't talk, you should say so, not keep it going" and hung up. What's so difficult with "I'm busy now. I call you later"? She's 25 years old for crying out loud!

She called me last week to tell me that she and her on again off again she's not living with him boyfriend were going out to dinner at the end of the block to celebrate their "4th anniversary." I said "4th anniversary of what?" "Of being together. Sort of. Except for a couple of months." I told her to stop by to pick up her gift from Mexico. They didn't. The only time we ever see her is when we are doing a party or dinner out that she can worm her way into.

She's been particularly insolent to me since she got all involved with my "I'm so perfect and happy and no one else is as good as me" sister at Christmas. husband and I talked about it. We agreed that she seems very unhappy and is making very poor life decisions (going back to the boyfriend who doesn't love her). We agreed that her dad isn't helping things by providing her with a $700 a month allowance, car insurance, health insurance, and cell phone with no strings attached. I have known about all of this for years.

We think that she is disappointed that she actually has to work at a job 40 hpw at minimal pay and she doesn't have much other than a designer bag her boyfriend gave her and the world's most expensive tanning package to show for it. She had gone to see her therapist from when she was a kid and gotten back on AD's a few years back, but she only saw him once or twice and is off the medications. We think she should be seeing a therapist on a regular basis.

So, I called her dad. He told me that he has only seen her twice since Christmas, once when he bought her dinner for his birthday, and once when he bought her dinner for her birthday. He has only spoken to her a couple of times, and she is not speaking to her half sister, who is younger, has graduated college, and inherited a great deal - a million or so when you include the real estate - from L's step mom.
He told me (finally) about all of the financial support he's given her, and that maybe it's not a good idea. DUH. He said "It seems to me that the best job in town is being RC's oldest daughter." Now, bear in mind that he blew through her pittance of an inheritance from the step-mother by repaying $ that someone misappropriated from client funds, she does have something to hold over/against him. But if she loves him, he needs to let that go and so does she.

Bearing in mind that he is an attorney diagnosed with an Narcissist Complex who likes to talk about himself, we are being gloried with an hour of his time this evening. This means that somehow we have to steer the conversation back to L from time to time, and get to the point that he sees a way to wean her off the money teet. I also plan to suggest that should he continue to provide health insurance through his company (which is why she gets $700 a month as "wages she does no work for because she has to be an employee to qualify for insurance,) it be with the proviso that she get regular therapy with copays out of her pocket. husband and I will be (and so should her dad be) willing to participate from time to time to deal with her in a safe way (no screaming crying fits) on some of her obvious issues with us.

I plan to make some notes to keep myself on track. I know that if I get to relate some of my recent situational concerns with her, then I have to be patient and allow him time to talk as well. Unfortunately, we are meeting at 5:30, he's always late, and he has a 7:00 appointment with his therapy group. I think it's a good thing that he is meeting immediately with his therapy group, because I don't think anyone would disagree with what I am saying, and hopefully he won't be able to stop himself from talking about it.

husband and I agreed that we don't want him to present anything to her as "your mom and I agree" unless we can present a united front, and that means he would have to come back to us with a proposal as to how he will approach it. It's not realistic that we should approach her about the money/things he gives her because it's got nothing to do with us.

So, think good thoughts that both he and I can set our gripes aside for an hour in order to get to the heart of the matter, and that we can get him to agree to take time to think about this seriously, and discuss his thoughts about it with us before he presents it to her, or at least that he will present it to her without saying "your mom and I talked" and then do something that I wouldn't have done.

 

[everywoman]

Good luck Witz. Hopefully he will listen. L seems to have all of her self-worth tied up into what she has instead of who she is. That's a tough issue to tackle. Hopefully if bio will push therapy---especially if it is tied in with finances---she will bite. She obviously needs it. I would look for a female therapist. They will be less likely to be wiled by her feminine charm and she the issues at hand Good luck.

 

[Suz]

Good luck, Witz!

Suz

 

[WhymeMom?]

Hope you find the right "compromise" to help your difficult child learn that the daddy money tree doesn't always bear fruit........

 

[Hound dog]

Wishing you luck. And keeping fingers crossed.

Hugs

 

[witzend]

I told him that I didn't want him to anything to her that he hadn't cleared with me first. He agreed with everything we said about her behavior and that she is depressed. He was surprised to hear that she was yelling at me on the phone, and hung his head in shame at some of the stuff she has been up to. He's really been in the dark as to what she's been doing with her life.

The best he could come up with was he is going to tell her that he and I had a good talk, and that we were both concerned about her and felt that she was depressed, that she needed to think about what she wants from life and start investing in her own happiness.

As my mom used to say, I guess it's better than a poke in the eye with a sharp stick... And I suppose it is about as good as he can do. But we have put a bug in his ear, and maybe he will rethink his own position soon.

 

[Fran]

Witz, I think it's a good idea to approach L together but since you know the situation with L's dad, you know it won't go as you think it should. He is not going to do only what you agreed to. Human nature isn't like that from what I can tell. Being a black/white sort of person that I am, I can see that I would have to anticipate different scenario's so that I don't lose site of the goal. Which is to encourage L to seek therapy, and to speak to her parents in a civil tone of voice. Approaching the subject of her seeming to use her parents for dinners and things might be a topic that should lightly brought up but encourage her to seek counseling for that sort of greediness and superficiality. It could trigger a lot of defensiveness.

It can be a productive meeting if there is a clear goal that both of the parents agree to but the rest of the conversations, reactions and rebuttals will be pretty fluid. We just can't control what other's say and think. No matter what is agreed to earlier on because he may not have the same interpretation as you do. Besides they (both L and her dad) can present other sides to issues that I would miss in my black and white sort of brain.

Does that make sense? I'm wishing that this will be a satisfactory meeting of mother and daughter and her father.

 

[witzend]

That seems very reasonable, Fran. Unfortunately, there is no way that he would agree to set up a formal meeting. It's just not his style. Most likely he will get mad at her at some point and tell her that he and I talked. I knew I took that chance when I talked to him. His being an attorney, he knows what confidentiality is, and my having experience with him, know the difference between implying confidentiality and saying "you can't tell her what I said."

I told him "you can't tell her the particulars of what I said unless I am there or you clear it with me first." I hope he will stick to that, and to the basics of "we're worried that you're not as happy as you could be". But, we'll see. I'm a big girl, though. If he discloses what I said, I can deal with it. It's pretty much what I already told her myself.

 

[Star*]

Conducting a meeting with someone narcissistic, that used to be your mate, and trying to allow him to think it is ALL ABOUT HIM, but getting a word in edgewise for the sake of L - all while allowing him to belive that THIS IS HIS IDEA?

PFt - NO Sweat kid - you can do eeeeeeeet!

(report immediately after meeting to be sure you don't need me to wire you bail money)

sending you my sock puppet for those times when he just draggggggggs on and on......

 

[Fran]

Sorry witz, I thought you were all meeting together this evening. As I reread your thread, I realize this is just the preparation meeting for dad and daughter to have a conversation. Sorry.




"Bearing in mind that he is an attorney diagnosed with an Narcissist Complex who likes to talk about himself, we are being gloried with an hour of his time this evening. This means that somehow we have to steer the conversation back to L from time to time, and get to the point that he sees a way to wean her off the money teet. I also plan to suggest that should he continue to provide health insurance through his company (which is why she gets $700 a month as "wages she does no work for because she has to be an employee to qualify for insurance,) it be with the proviso that she get regular therapy with copays out of her pocket. husband and I will be (and so should her dad be) willing to participate from time to time to deal with her in a safe way (no screaming crying fits) on some of her obvious issues with us."