Update, it's been awhile.

[recoveringenabler]

Esri, you don't have to justify your feelings to us. Having an 18 year old daughter who is doing drugs and acting towards you in the fashion she is is cause for worry. You have every right to make the choices you have and I support them. We all make the choices we can live with, no one is walking in our shoes but us.

We have some strong personalities here who agree and disagree about the appropriate ways in which to deal with our adult troubled children but in the final analysis, it is you who have to live with yourself. Read our replies and take with you what feels right.

What you are going through is hard. Letting go is hard. Trying to help them when they refuse our help, are doing drugs and disrespecting us is cause for concern and clearly a reason to set some boundaries.

Hang in there Esri. You're not alone.

 

[Hope_Floats]

I am so sorry for your pain, Esri. There is something just so nightmarish to hear someone that you birthed, and cared for, and nurtured, and had such hope for, to say those nasty things and to essentially "uninvite" you to their lives. It's a nightmare that most parents would never understand.

But we can emerge from the nightmare and, at 18, tell ourselves that we have raised them the best we could, and now they are free to run their own lives.

Then we have to go and build our own, building one that we can celebrate. That's a big hurdle, but stay here with us, and learn from the wise warrior moms who are doing it, one day at a time.

 

[Nancy]

Esri I read your post and my heart went right out to you because everything you described is exactly how my daughter acted, down to us having to go pick up her car and hide it because at the time she was still living with us. And when she moved out to live with her drug friends we turned her phone off and she went to the carrier and tried to put her phone in her ame and they wouldn't let her (lol). Honestly when you said you can't find anything good to say right now that is EXACTLY how I felt. I had neighbors/friends who didn't understand and a couple even told me we were being too hard. It is very easy to look at things differently fromthe outside, but I knew the real story inside, we lived it.

My daughter also put some very vulgar things on facebook about us and to my surprise a friend of hers from high school called her out on it and said that we were wonderful parents and that she was getting herself in a lot of trouble and none of her old friends wanted anything to do wth her anymore. I was afraid to go out into the community because I was sure everyone knew what was going on. It was a very dark time for me and my anger was so close to the surface. I said and thought some very angry things about difficult child. Fortunately those closest to us understood and supported us.

You were right to take the car. The phone I can go either way on, we did turn our daughter's off but ended up turning it back on just so we could have contact with her in an emergency, believe me we did not want to talk to her, just wanted her to have a lifeline. But since your daughter is living with her boyfriend that may not be necesary, and she has a job and can get prepaid phone service. Understand that our daughter ended up in rehab and a halfway house for about a year all together.

It is so hard to hear your child tell you they hate you. My difficult child wrote on fb that she hoped I would jump off a bridge but to call her first so she could come and watch and laugh. That cut through me like a knife. Every consequence we gave her she came back with more reasons why she didn't care because she hated us. It's the drugs talking. People who say pot is not bad have no idea what we live with. My daughter just smoked pot and drank....and yet she was foul mouthed and nasty and violent and lost job after job for the very reason you stated...coming in late and getting others to cover for her.

I don't know if you belong to any support groups, Families Anonymous is one I have found helpful. The most helpful one was a parent group through her rehab. We understood each other, our stories were all the same, different names same story. If you found a support group you could start to separate your anger and hurt feelings from your daughter. It doesn't mean you will accept her behavior, you will just learn how to live your life without it consuming you.

Come here and vent anytime you want. I have found that those who have been through this understand and accept without question. We have a rule in our support group, we do not try to solve someone's problem or tell them how they should feel, we accept their situation as truth and let them have their feelings whatever they are.

I feel a connection with you because so much of what you have said I lived with. The ages 14-21 were the worst I can imagine. Life is much better now, I have a very good relationship with my daughter. I wish the same for you.

 

[dstc_99]

Esri,

Let me say first that I think you did the right thing. Many of us bend ourselves into pretzel shapes trying to keep contact with our kids hopine to keep them in our circle in any way we can. They don't appreciate it.

My daughter moved out and went to live with her grands and then her boyfriend. I kept my daughter on our cell plan until it expired and gave her months of notice that it was expiring. All she did was have her grands put her on their plan. The goal had been for her to learn to pay bills on occasion and to build credit. She didn't want to so she didn't. She also didn't appreciate the fact we paid for the phone during a period of time where she didn't even speak to us.

We did the same with her car and insurance. She never paid a penny because she didn't want to. When we discussed her getting her own car she was ticked! We were taking her car from her and it was a piece of crap anyway.

She posted all the hateful little comments on FB and twitter and refused to do anything we asked but yet expected us to continue to pay the bills and play mom and dad.

It is now about 2 years later. She is living with us again having failed at the living with boyfriend attempt and the living with grands. The grands of course would take her back in a heart beat but she doesn't want to deal with grandmother. She is much nicer and has a lot more respect for things because we are making her earn them. We don't put up with the verbal abuse and we cut it off the minute it starts. I stand by my statements and stick to my punishments. At the same time I am really a nice person and pretty flexible which is something she is finally learning to see.

DO not let your difficult child push you down. Do what you have to do to let her know you wil not be treated this way. Don't fall into her drama and play her games. No one ever wins them. As for the drugs there is nothing you can do other than not support them and let her know that whenever she is ready you will help her get treatment.

 

[BusynMember]

Esri, please come back.

My son has a GOOD job and is not a drug addict and I'm here and we had horrible times with him. He had mental health issues, but was also abusive to me. You can and should be here and belong here and it is pretty hard to count your blessings about a grown child who is treating you like crapola. I didn't even LIKE my child sometimes, I am ashamed to say. I even sometimes wished I'd never had him...there, I said it.

I hope you post again. We would like you to stay here...hugs!!!!

 

[GuideMe]

Sometimes, through our own experiences, we jump to conclusions. I feel as though I wasn't out of line for I wasn't anymore direct with her than others have been direct with me. When I complained, I was told to show grace and understanding around that since we all have good intentions here, which MY intentions are GOOD. Since I am being called out on this thread, can I defend myself here as well? I feel like I am being mad out to be the bad guy here. Can I ask exactly what I said that was wrong? I think it's very mild compared to what has been said to me and others in the past.

Let's look at the situation and why I responded the way I did. I pride myself of giving individual responses and not let my own experiences skew my vision. When a poster makes a post, I read every word and really listen, I even go back and read their previous posts just like I did with Ersi. Maybe for any of you who did not approve of my answers, please go back and read her prior posts. Most of you who are commenting now already said back then, what I have already said.

If you go to her first thread ever on this board , she says that she is not going to go into details. So I was basing my advice on what she did give.

Second. Her daughter has been out of the home since June and has not asked her mother for help for anything. She pays her car payments and cell phone. What is this daughter doing that is so wrong? Ok, she broke the agreement of not staying clean to which I agreed a thousand times, Ersi should take the car. When have I said any differently? Please point it out to me.

Daughter wrote one message on facebook saying "there you got what you wanted. I hope you're happy now". To me, that is nothing compared to what your children have wrote to you or about you on social media. That's what I mean when I say that sometimes our own experiences skew our thinking and we immediately jump to conclusions without REALLY listening and treating each situation individually.

Ersi said she is smoking weed and drinking. Coming from a mother of a former pot addict, unless her daughter is addicted to it, it's not actually a call for serious concern. Most of you are bringing up your own child's drug addictions (which include meth and more hard core drugs) which Ersi's daughter's "drug use" pales in compared to your kids and my child. She is not some harden drug addict criminal. She is smoking pot and drinking, which many young adults do, which many of us have done.

I am going to be honest, I feel there is a lot of over reaction here to this daughter for whom I developed a heart for. In my eyes, I see a girl who is trying to be independent, not asking for anything, and not getting into trouble. She should be applauded for that. Is she making some minor mistakes? Of course, but we all make mistakes. But her mistakes aren't screaming to me any need for some serious concern. She is a young adult learning life. The mere fact that she moved out of the house six months ago, hasn't asked her parents for anything, pays her car payment and cell phone payment is actually very admiring and I don't even know the girl, but I am proud of her. What is this daughter doing that is so horribly wrong? For her mother to say the only positive thing she see's is only that she is still alive, really actually stunned me and.... hurt me. I don't understand it. I totally agree with Ersi taking the car away, that was the right thing to do. But I don't agree with her over-all attitude that it's all gloom and doom for her daughter. I am going to be honest, I am not sorry for how I feel. Obviously, my opinion is not a popular one. However, I think it would be wrong for me to say I take back how I feel. If I said it in such an awful manner, I apologize Ersi.

 

[BusynMember]

Oy vey.

 

[GuideMe]

Haha, MWM. You should go back to Ersi's old posts because back then you had the same sentiment as I did and do. Read your comments.

And also, you have been way more direct with me then I ever was with anyone else

 

[Lil]

Okay ladies, let's all be nice.

Esri, it is good to see you back, though we're all sorry you must be.

You were right to take the car. If you had an agreement with her that you would drug test and that was her reaction, you absolutely had the right to take the car! Why should you risk your insurance and her life if she may be driving impaired? The phone? Well, sounds like she pretty much dared you to. I'd probably do it too under those circumstances. In fact, we have taken our son's car (never really his, but the one we let him drive for years) and we have left the phone on until June. We've already told him it's going off then and it will, whether he can pay for it or not. The fact is, she can get a track phone and the cards at Walmart are less than $50/mo. She'll be fine.

My reading of what you are saying is that those two things are really not the problem. The problem is she's cut you off, disrespecting you and hurting you with her "eff you" attitudes and statements.

I'm sure it's very hurtful for you to hear (see) your daughter say such things. You love her. She's doing drugs and you want to stop that.

You have done all you can.

I know you didn't like GM's posts, but there really are positives here. I also know you were angry when you said, "Didn't know she had to be homeless and jobless to come here", but try to look at that. Sometimes it helps to see that it could be worse. That she is maintaining employment means she has some drive. She may not be making the best choices, but she has enough gumption to pay her bills. Legally, she is an adult. She's working, not asking for monetary support. You had one way to control her pot smoking and that was the car. She's called that bluff and lost. She's angry and striking out the only way she can, by hurting you.

As you said, she's alive. Where there is life there is hope. She is very young. This could very well be some wild stage and she may very well outgrow it. I can't say she won't get worse, but things may just as well may get much better.

But the fact is, you've done all you can.

Give her some time to cool off. Then remind her you love her. Try to breathe. We are here for you.

 

[Nancy]

Let us please all try to respect others' views. Remember that this place is a soft place to land for the weary souls. I do not want this thread turned into a defending of one's views. We all have different views based on our experiences. Please remember that this is Esri's daughter and while we may have our own opinions, that's all it is, our opinion. Esri has the right to her feelings without being condemned or having to justify them.

I will not hesitate to lock this thread if we can't all get along. But I have seen it before and I know we can all step back and remember how we were feeling in the middle of our chaos with our difficult child's and how important it was to get the support here without feeling threatened.

 

[BusynMember]

I think, as do most people here with adult children who substance abuse, that drinking and pot is nothing to be soft about. I can't agree that we are too harsh about it. It can lead to other things and often does, including symthetic pot,which can kill a kid.. What I did worked. I have a functioning, clean kid with a job, a SO and a house of her own and would rather not be criticized for being too harsh. She is a great mom who is self-sufficient and would never think to ask for anything as she is an independent young woman.

My daughter tells me I did the right thing, thankyouverymuch.

If somebody thinks we are too hard on drugs and other sbustances, including alcohol, then maybe it's best not to say so. It can be misconstrued at criticizing somebody else, although I would take it with a grain of salt. Been around too long, done too much, to second guess myself. For me and my beloved, sweet daughter, we definitely did the right thing...tough love. We have a close, loving relationship and laugh about those days. They ended when she turned nineteen.

And, sorry, but not ALL or MOST teens substance abuse. That is incorrect.

Sorry, Nancy. You know how much I respect you and all you've done for your difficult child, but saying we are too hard on kids is a blat statement that apparently covers all of us. I disagree, felt insulted, and wanted to refute it. Now I'm finished.

 

[GuideMe]

Again, that's your experiences MWM, which we all have and why we give the advice that we give.

For as many as you know that pot and drinking lead them into harder drugs, I know just as many where it stopped right there. As a teen I smoked pot, on the weekends and drank, on the weekends and it never once lead me into hard core drugs such as meth, heroine , crack or any drug of that sort. Thankyouverymuch I can say that same thing for hundreds of people that I know personally as well. I hung out with different crowds as a teen. One crowd was full of kids who were very decent kids. They smoked pot and drank every weekend, I did it with them and every single person in that crowd are doing very well today. They went onto college, have careers, families, the good life.

My point is, we cannot assume the worse each and every time. We do not know what her pot or alcohol use really is. It could be every weekend, once a month and just for fun. I am not going to automatically assume the worse for the child. That is not fair to the child and it's wrong. And you're taking out of context what I am saying. For the 30th time, I said the mother did the right thing in taking the car. However calling her a drug addict or needing rehab is a COMPLETELY different thing. Two TOTALLY different things.

If somebody thinks we are too hard on drugs and other substances, including alcohol, then maybe it's best not to say so. It can be misconstrued at criticizing somebody else, although I would take it with a grain of salt

Ah, but it's not right for you to say what advice I can or cannot give. You say it can be misconstrued at criticizing somebody else, but seriously MWM, when are you ever concerned with that when you give advice? Lol. Come on. My advice is the truth just like your advice is the truth. As I said, I know many people where it stopped with just pot and alcohol. It's the truth. Am I suppose to hide the truth? It's a young adult thing to do in this day in age MWM. It just is and has been for the last 30 years. You can take with a grain of salt and grain of pepper. We are all entitled to do so. So why even get bothered with what I say?

 

[GuideMe]

Anyway, I don't have a problem with what Erzi did with the car concerning the drug use. I support her 1000% in that decision. I'm not even going to make it about that.

However, I am not going to let that over shadow what I think her daughter has as amazing qualities. Qualities that we would move mountains for our difficult child's to have. Sorry, it's the way I feel. I feel her not getting along with her mom is the normal teenage angst and they will recover from that. Her daughter is working, paying her bills, graduated from high school, living on her own, no legal trouble, no teenage pregnancy, no hard core drugs, no car accidents, no tickets..etc, etc. , I think that is more than enough right there to assume the better than the worse. With that scenario, especially with what most our difficult child's are like, it wouldn't be right to not assume better. I wouldn't be able to live with myself if I didn't defend the daughter in some things for what I think is right, even though that probably has made me very disliked right now. I was hoping that showing her mom all the positives would make her feel better, but it didn't and I'm so sorry for that. That was my one and only intention.

 

[Nancy]

I am not going to automatically assume the worse for the child. That is not fair to the child and it's wrong.

It is not up to you or me or anyone else to assume anything about this child, she is not our child. If I listened to every one of my neighbors who allowed their teens to do pot and drink and turn their heads I would probably have a dead child by now. Every person is different and no one can assume they know better than the parent.

I am going to lock this thread now.

Esri if you are reading please take your time and consider coming back. You are welcome to browse the Substance Abuse forum and decide if you would like to post there also, we have all been through what you are going through. I can promise you no judgement, just caring.