difficult child's current status

[klmno]

I'm going to have to get a few things out in several different posts just because I don't think I can handle going thru all of it right now in one post. But he was put back on medications, due to his request to have a MH evaluation a few mos ago. I honestly think his intent was to try to get medications that would either make him high or that he could trade for medications he wanted with other kids in Department of Juvenile Justice. Anyway, they first tried abilify and now are trying depakote. Obviously, the psychiatrist hasn't reviewed the first medication difficult child trialed in the past. At least he/she must have the knowledge that difficult child had been on MSs, can't take anti-depressants, and had a questionable diagnosis of BiPolar (BP) before. difficult child told me that he'd told the psychiatrist that.

Today at visitation, I swear difficult child acted high. He had three obvious and major mood swings in 1 hour. It reminded me of all the side effects of these medications and that there had been many times I thought they were making him worse when he was living with me trialing them all. Now, when he was in Department of Juvenile Justice before and they took him off medications, he went months in there doing just fine without any medications- no behavior issues, good grades, etc. So I have 2 questions about this before I conclude that difficult child has traded medications or gotten himself over medicated just to feel high- 1) if you aren't truly BiPolar (BP) and you take typical MSs, can it make you 'loopy'?, and 2) Can depakote make you loopy when your body is still adjusting to it? He's been on it about 1 1/2-2 weeks now.

 

[DammitJanet]

Okay, I cant see how either of those medications should be something he would want for a high. Depakote will make a person seem very sedated at first as they get the dosage adjusted. I dont think it would be something anyone would choose for a high. I know there is no street value. I pretty much know what people will buy. Now there is a street value for seroquel because people who use cocaine or crack or meth will use that to come down off it and sleep. Also the normal sleep medications...ambien, lunesta etc.

If he is or isnt BiPolar (BP) isnt so much the question for me. They can use a MS for other things such as some personality disorders and some depressive disorders. They wont kill him. If by chance he is sedated for a bit maybe it is making things a bit easier for a little while. That will wear off in short order.

 

[klmno]

Well that's good news- I hope he hasn't gotten a hold of stims and been taking them like he did before.

He didn't seem tired, just loopy and looked stoned, and was talking about all sorts of different 'happy' things, then almost cried and had to hide it when I commented on him appearing to be high. Then he seemed angry, then normal. I'm not just referring to things he was talking about, I'm talking about his speech, body language, look on his face, etc. I swear I have to wonder if these medications can cause mood lability- if that's the correct term. He's getting close to his release date, kind of, and it's still up in the air where he'll be going so I have no doubt his emotions and moods are all over the place- I doubt the psychiatrist is considering any of that when rx'ing medications for him or considering a diagnosis for him.

Of course this means he'll most likely come out with a diagnosis of BiPolar (BP) that I have little to no faith in- the psychiatrists in Department of Juvenile Justice are minimally involved and, well, less than ideal...but that means it will be a parole requirement for difficult child to see a psychiatrist, stay on medications, me get him on insurance and get him to all these appts, if he comes to live with me.

difficult child said the lady from the "re-entry" program came to see him last week for his interview so she can recommend what service, if any, they will give him. The PO has given me NO information about this program except to say they had a group home that wasn't run by Department of Juvenile Justice. It appears to me it is but never mind that. difficult child said she asked him his goals and then explained that they had a long term group home for boys who needed a group home until they are 18 and on their own, they have a short term group home for boys where the goal is reunificaTION WITH THE FAMILY, AND THEY HAVE SERVICES THEY CAN GIVE A (sorry- hit caps) kid who goes straight home- such as a mentor and help getting a job. been there done that. He said she asked which he'd prefer and he told her he wanted to come straight home but his mom wasn't sure she wanted him to. I can almost guess where this is leading- PO has scheduled an appointment to meet with me in 10 days.

Let's just say I need to keep buying time- I haven't gotten into detail before about what the attny I saw a mo or two ago told me just to be absolutely certain that no one in my family can ever find out what I was told, but I'm buying time here.

And why this hurt at one point and made me feel better at another I have no idea, but difficult child told me that he thought his whole problem had been that he quit respecting me as his mom years ago. I asked him why and he said he didn't know and it didn't matter. Ladies, I was not ever a mom who did drugs, didn't work or provide a decent home, cook his meals, or went out with boyfriend's or left my son with just anyone to go party. I swear I took him to scouts, swim lessons, soccer, did everything I could to be a good mom. Anyway, he continued talking and said he had blamed me for everything that ever went wrong in his life no matter what it was and used that as an excuse and said that "now he's going to force himself to respect me".

yeah, like that will work.

He'd say anything right now to try to get me to let him come and live with me the day he's released. I did talk to him about this decision not being about forgiveness or anything else- it's about maximizing his chances for success. And that he needed to understand that it was one thing for him to decide that he didn't care about his future or if he got locked up again, but it was another to turn against his mother and commit offenses against a family member and most boys he's incarcerated with probably have never even gone that far- and difficult child did it more than once.


Thanks for reading if you made it this far- I guess I needed to get some of this out.

Oh- the TH next to me is vacant, the one next to that is a couple with a 5yo difficult child. Go figure. The father yells at him and the mother says right in front of him what a "nightmare it is to try to take care of him". I don't know that I'm comfortable recommending this forum but was thinking about recommending "The Explosive Child". I did chat with her long enough to let her know that I understood and had a son that was difficult to raise, too.

 

[Liahona]

Sounds like he is playing the poor-pitiful-me-with-the-bad-mama-that-doesn't-want-me card. Good luck with the meeting with PO. When interested parents are involved they should talk to the parents before talking to the difficult children.

 

[BusynMember]

I think drugs are involved. Certain combos can make you so doped you don't care. Also, maybe he's mixing in some of his own. been there done that.

 

[klmno]

All I know for sure at this point is that he has the best chance for making it ITRW if he goes to a living environment where he does respect the authority and the PO/courts/GAL/sd/system back that authority up instead of blaming that authority or over-riding it. That's the bottom line to me at this point.

difficult child asked me why, if this place a long term group home and he's getting close to 18, then if I wouldn't let him come home right away, why not just put him in the long term group home. Now he said this like it was supposed to prove his arguement that he should come straight to live with me. What it did though, was remind me that this was my initial question to PO- why aren't they preparing this kid for adulthood instead of using the excuse that since he wants a diploma instead of a GED, he HAS to come back to me?

 

[klmno]

Also, maybe he's mixing in some of his own.

Could you clarify how that can happen if he's only on depakote and he's in Department of Juvenile Justice where he can only cheek and trade medications, if he's trying not to take them as rx'd?

 

[klmno]

UP

 

[DDD]

We used depakote for awhile and there was no high from it. I hope your meeting goes well with the PO.
As far as "respect", I don't think his definition is the same as yours. In the system and on the streets the expression is used to meant as someone who is "hard" as opposed to "soft". Peer definition of that word doesn't mean deferring to a parent's position of authority. Frankly I don't see most of our difficult child's deferring to parents. on the other hand they can learn not to "disrespect" or "be disrespectful". That is the best, in my humble opinion, that you can hope for. difficult child's place themselves in position #1 all the time. I don't think your expectations should be higher than that. He sees himself as a man. If and when he comes home I hope he doesn't "buck". I hope he can share life with you and that you all will have some happy times. DDD

 

[rejectedmom]

I cannot answer the medications question. I just wanted to send you strength as you once again deal with this mess. -RM

 

[klmno]

thank you, DDD! I'm starting to get past my initial gut-wrenching hurt I felt when my interpretation was that difficult child just stopped respecting me. I think there's some manipulation coming from him right now, too, as another poster suggested. I guess right now I'm trying to remind myself that I need to find a decision I'm most comfortable with, as far as what I think is in difficult child's best interest and still offers me a reasonable sense of safety. I have to keep my head in control and not let my mommy heart run in and bring difficult child home unless I really think that gives him the best chance for success.

 

[klmno]

Thank you, RM. He;ll be 18 13 mos after release, assuming release goes as planned. But at 17yo, a new door opens for services that I can't describe here just yet.

 

[AnnieO]

k, I don't know a whole lot about most medications, but the day after I accidentally took Onyxx's Seroquel, I was loopy and stoned. All day. It was HORRIBLE. Nice part was, I hated it, it was awful, but I just didn't care. Does that make sense?

Sigh...

 

[klmno]

That's interesting, Step. I know depakote made difficult child's cognitive abilities plummit when he first trialed it (not to mention it turned him into a frightening time bomb), and his grades have dropped this semester. That's why I thought it could possibly make him look and sound stoned, too. Whether it can make him feel high, I have no idea. But on Sunday, difficult child went from elated to crying to angry to 'normal' on more than one occassion. As I said before though, this is an emotional time and stressful time so some of the mood swings can only be expected, in my humble opinion.

 

[DammitJanet]

They put Cory on depakote and one of the AP's. Not risperdal...the other biggie. This was when they first dxd him with BiPolar (BP) at 13. When we went to visit him in the psychiatric hospital he was so out of it we could hardly get him to converse with us in a family therapy session. Im not entirely sure which medication it was that had him drugged up...the depakote or the AP. I have no idea why I cant remember the name of the AP, we have kids on here on it but the name is slipping my mind. Not abilify. Not seroquel. The other one that is used so often.

 

[klmno]

risperdal (sp)??

 

[DammitJanet]

no...its the one that puts the most weight on

 

[buddy]

Seroquel????

sorry, saw you already said no to that...oops

 

[DDD]

I was just thinking about something. Maybe next time the two of you are face to face you can ask him specific questions about his expectations of life at home. Perhaps if it is conversational you might get some insight into whether he is anticipating more freedom than you are comfortable envisioning. Advanced conversations might help pave the way. DDD

 

[klmno]

I've tried to do that a little but haven't gotten too far, and that has concerned me but I'm not sure if I'm using the wrong Icebreaker or if I'm just not hearing what I want to hear. If anyone has suggestions on how to open that door to a good conversation with difficult child, please let me know. I did ask him once if he got home and had freedom to do what he wanted, what would he do, and he said "eat real food".