The Call
- Thread starter New Leaf
- Start date
I'm praying for Tornado......
......and for you, our very precious, very wise, warrior of the heart... Leafy....
......and for you, our very precious, very wise, warrior of the heart... Leafy....
Littleboylost
Long road but the path ahead holds hope.
Jail is where we finally reached E and had him commit to a rehab program. He wasted away his time waiting for his bed smoking pot drinking and drugging. Probably using the stolen money to feather his little drug nest with girlfriend at Cop Mom (still makes my blood boil). We had so little hope and I am almost embarrassed for the lack of hope we had. Hope with no expectations is a place that is so very very hard to come to a present state in.
I meditate and practice being in the frame of mind “Hope with no expecttions”. I wish I were not such a realist some days and this state might be easier to maintain.
I find my mind wandering to the future and dream of graduations and job success....and then my thoughts turn dark and I get lost in my head. Pull back mama to hope with no expectations...have to tell myself over and over.
I pray that Tornado finds a curve in he road towards a better path. I do hope that jail is a safe and supportive space for her. She is warm and fed and can not gat into too much trouble while she is in jail and that is something. I slept like crap when Ewas in jail. He raged and I refused to have contact. Cop mom and girlfriend harassed me to set him loose. NO enabling NO. He got sober and clear headed. He chose rehab. He chose to drug until detox and rehab and fought that all the way. Hard to believe when we look at him now.
He goes to church ...his own decision his is not a faith based program. He volunteers with the church group most of whom are elderly. They all say how they simply can not believe E was in as bad a shape as he was. So he asked me for some pictures and details and he gave a talk to the congregation. He encouraged them not to junsge and never give up hope. That really touched me.
The rehab nurse, the program lead for youth with criminal past, and his school counsellor all day they just love him and if they had a son they would want him to be just like E. He just puts a silly grin on his face and says oh...you could skip a few elements along the way; and says I love you mom and dad thanks for not losing hope.
A long winded post to say Hope it I all we have and we must not allow expectation to creep in just hope.
I suppose it is what Pima Chödrön refers to as the Big Squeeze. Here is the quote.
“there is often discrepancy between our ideas and what we actually encounter. For instants, raising children, we have a lot of good ideas, but sometimes it’s very challenging to put together all the good ideas with the way our children really are, there at the breakfast table with food all over themselves. Or with meditation you’ve noticed how difficult it is to actually feel emotions without getting totally swept away by them, or how difficult it is simply to cultivate friendliness towards yourself when you’re feeling completely miserable or panicked or caught up? There’s a discrepancy between your inspiration and the situation as it present itself, the immediacy of the situation. It’s the room between those two things - the squeeze between vision and reality - that cause you to grow up, to wake up to be 100% decent, alive, and compassionate. The big squeezes one of the most productive places on the spiritual path.”
I am still in the rub most days and I do find Ian more realIstic and compassionate and less of an emotional train wreck. It is what it is. Life.
On a final note man oh man we all have got to be some of the most productive spiritual people there are.
hoopaa ia me ka manaolana
ole iho iakou wale manaʻolana
A huge cyber hug to you my dearest Leafy. Wave to my father next time you paddle and see the turtles. I know his spirit is with them.
New Leaf
Well-Known Member
Tornado called a few days ago, I was out in the yard, so I didn't speak with her. I have been wrestling with the idea of whether or not I would accept a call from her, or even if she would call again.
She did today.
As the automated message rambled on about one minute.....call would be recorded....blah, blah, blah, I wondered what would she sound like. It has nearly been a year since I have spoken with her.
Rugged street voice.............
“Ma.......get me out Ma. I’m in here for nothing. It’s only ten percent of my bail.....you can put it on your credit card.”
I took a deep breath and said no.
“You even effin care or what? Who the f does that? I’m on the streets taking care of myself and you don’t even look for me!”
The minute ended.
Wow.
Same old, same old.
Well that is some way to try to get someone to help you.
How the heck was I supposed to look for her? She knows where I live.
Huh.
I read up on meth detox and it is not pleasant. I would imagine she is feeling pretty low and just itching to get high. In her mind, it is still everyone else's fault, especially mine.
Balderdash.
I am not bailing her out, and probably wont take another call from her anytime soon.
(((HUGS)))
Leafy
She did today.
As the automated message rambled on about one minute.....call would be recorded....blah, blah, blah, I wondered what would she sound like. It has nearly been a year since I have spoken with her.
Rugged street voice.............
“Ma.......get me out Ma. I’m in here for nothing. It’s only ten percent of my bail.....you can put it on your credit card.”
I took a deep breath and said no.
“You even effin care or what? Who the f does that? I’m on the streets taking care of myself and you don’t even look for me!”
The minute ended.
Wow.
Same old, same old.
Well that is some way to try to get someone to help you.
How the heck was I supposed to look for her? She knows where I live.
Huh.
I read up on meth detox and it is not pleasant. I would imagine she is feeling pretty low and just itching to get high. In her mind, it is still everyone else's fault, especially mine.
Balderdash.
I am not bailing her out, and probably wont take another call from her anytime soon.
Thank you LBL. I am actually sleeping okay, because I know where she is, so in that respect, jail is not the worse thing that could happen. I think refusing to have contact with someone who is raging is wise. Tornado will have to stew in her own juices for a bit. I did put in a call to the substance abuse services number, of course it is a voicemail.
I am so glad that E is doing so well. I hope he continues on this path.
Cyber hugs back to you, LBL. I will definitely wave to your father.
(((HUGS)))
Leafy
Thinking of you Leafy........How're you doing today?
(((HUGS)))
(((HUGS)))
Kalahou
Well-Known Member
Oh Leaf, to read the words was just like hearing the exact convos I got from my son in the early days of his jail time. It took him a while to realize he would have to be there many months, and to know I would not listen to any ranting...
Those were also my exact feelings. I so feel your pain. Sometimes I just could not answer the phone when I saw it was GTL.
Love and prayers stay with you, dear. You know we are here for you. Malama pono.
New Leaf
Well-Known Member
Hi Re. I am okay. A bit sad, but will let the feelings flow as I go about my day.
I am hoping that Tornado will get help while she detoxes. Thought about writing her a letter, just may do it (for me) but probably won’t send it. No sense wasting words on a bitter, addictive person. It won’t mean much to her in her present state.
Addiction is a selfish beast.
Now, to rise above and soldier on.
I have been around the block enough to know that there is nothing I can do or say that will move her towards change. She has got to want it for herself.
I admit, the whole situation still stings, and I am trying as best can to avoid the rabbit hole. We are creatures of habit. I found myself again reeling those tapes.......if this, if that. It just shows me I have more work to do to build myself up and not allow myself to ruminate over the rantings of an addict in forced detox.
I am going to go pick axe some nasty weeds on the mountain and will be chipping away at those thoughts at the same time.
Borrowing from my dads stoicism, he would so not put up with any of this
!
My quote thingee isn’t working. Thank you Re and Kalahou for your kindness and reaching out. I so appreciate the support. One of my young paddling friends said “I wish my aunties would stop bailing my cousins out.” This helps to fortify my decision, no matter what Tornado feels about that, and me. I saw a post on Facebook on enabling, where an addict talked about how to respond to an addicted love one.
It was basically “I love you.....NO! No I will not cater to you, because I love you!”
So up this mountain I will climb, in my camo pants and protective yard gear and pick axe away at all of those weeds and mixed emotions.
Mahalo nui loa and hugs back.
Leafy
I am hoping that Tornado will get help while she detoxes. Thought about writing her a letter, just may do it (for me) but probably won’t send it. No sense wasting words on a bitter, addictive person. It won’t mean much to her in her present state.
Addiction is a selfish beast.
Now, to rise above and soldier on.
I have been around the block enough to know that there is nothing I can do or say that will move her towards change. She has got to want it for herself.
I admit, the whole situation still stings, and I am trying as best can to avoid the rabbit hole. We are creatures of habit. I found myself again reeling those tapes.......if this, if that. It just shows me I have more work to do to build myself up and not allow myself to ruminate over the rantings of an addict in forced detox.
I am going to go pick axe some nasty weeds on the mountain and will be chipping away at those thoughts at the same time.
Borrowing from my dads stoicism, he would so not put up with any of this
!My quote thingee isn’t working. Thank you Re and Kalahou for your kindness and reaching out. I so appreciate the support. One of my young paddling friends said “I wish my aunties would stop bailing my cousins out.” This helps to fortify my decision, no matter what Tornado feels about that, and me. I saw a post on Facebook on enabling, where an addict talked about how to respond to an addicted love one.
It was basically “I love you.....NO! No I will not cater to you, because I love you!”
So up this mountain I will climb, in my camo pants and protective yard gear and pick axe away at all of those weeds and mixed emotions.
Mahalo nui loa and hugs back.
Leafy
Littleboylost
Long road but the path ahead holds hope.
Just catching up here. Ke pcon keeping on mama Leafy. Right is not always the easy path. And don’t we all know it.
Snow White
On the Mad Tea Party Ride
Leafy - I am catching up on posts and am saddened to come across yours. I am glad to hear that you followed the sage advice here and didn't bail her out. It is so hard and once you do it, it will become a habit. I made the mistake of paying a ton of money when mine trashed a hotel overseas. They had her in lockup and also the guy she was fighting with. I felt sick at the thought of her in a foreign prison, so I caved in. Never again. Then there is always the blame game. Amazing how they can keep that up.
I hope that prison will allow Tornado to detox safely and that she will see the wisdom in obtaining programming to help her with her addiction.
Try to take some time for yourself - I know its often difficult when we are so worried, anxious and cannot control the situation. Stay the course. You are a warrior mom!
Hugs to you.
I hope that prison will allow Tornado to detox safely and that she will see the wisdom in obtaining programming to help her with her addiction.
Try to take some time for yourself - I know its often difficult when we are so worried, anxious and cannot control the situation. Stay the course. You are a warrior mom!
Hugs to you.
New Leaf
Well-Known Member
Hi LBL and mcdonna,
Thanks so much for your encouragement.
Tornado is calling her sisters and they don’t pick up. I just came down from working in my jungle and noticed a voicemail from the notorious number. They don’t allow inmates to leave a message, just say their name and then the automated recording comes on. I am not playing the game, have enough to think about with my elderly mom in the hospital with pneumonia.
I have to put a ginormous bubble around my heart and emotions where my two are concerned. Every so often, my bubble springs a leak, and I have to work through the feelings. We have a huge homeless population here and I see my twos faces among those wearing their “chronic uniform”, hoodies and dark sunglasses. That is what Tornado would go back to, if she were bailed out. She is angry and feels abandoned, as does Rain, but the reality is, they abandoned themselves to meth.
I still hold out hope, but don’t have expectations. As far as I am concerned, Tornado is where she needs to be.
I hope one day she will understand our reason for this. That it comes from love. That some days, it is a huge effort to move forward and carry on with our lives while she and her sister destroy theirs with meth.
They have to decide.
The hard part is that it seems the longer they stay in their current state, the further they get from being of right mind and capable to break free.
I am cognizant that their like minded “friends” have become their family, and that we are targets.
Meth is soul stealing.
Still, prayer is powerful and anything is possible.
That, is what keeps me going.
My well children reassure me, and the kind thoughts and wisdom of my fellow warrior parents here, help to fortify me and guide me along the path.
My heartfelt thanks and love to all.
(((Hugs)))
Leafy
Thanks so much for your encouragement.
Tornado is calling her sisters and they don’t pick up. I just came down from working in my jungle and noticed a voicemail from the notorious number. They don’t allow inmates to leave a message, just say their name and then the automated recording comes on. I am not playing the game, have enough to think about with my elderly mom in the hospital with pneumonia.
I have to put a ginormous bubble around my heart and emotions where my two are concerned. Every so often, my bubble springs a leak, and I have to work through the feelings. We have a huge homeless population here and I see my twos faces among those wearing their “chronic uniform”, hoodies and dark sunglasses. That is what Tornado would go back to, if she were bailed out. She is angry and feels abandoned, as does Rain, but the reality is, they abandoned themselves to meth.
I still hold out hope, but don’t have expectations. As far as I am concerned, Tornado is where she needs to be.
I hope one day she will understand our reason for this. That it comes from love. That some days, it is a huge effort to move forward and carry on with our lives while she and her sister destroy theirs with meth.
They have to decide.
The hard part is that it seems the longer they stay in their current state, the further they get from being of right mind and capable to break free.
I am cognizant that their like minded “friends” have become their family, and that we are targets.
Meth is soul stealing.
Still, prayer is powerful and anything is possible.
That, is what keeps me going.
My well children reassure me, and the kind thoughts and wisdom of my fellow warrior parents here, help to fortify me and guide me along the path.
My heartfelt thanks and love to all.
(((Hugs)))
Leafy
EarthIsHard
Member
Leafy, So sorry to hear about your situation. It certainly is a Tornado! You are right for not bailing her out and you know it from her calls. Hopefully the longer she's in there, off meth, little by little her brain will give her a break from craving. It's not a program that she can walk out of. I wish I never would have bailed my son out the first few times, maybe it would have been easier for him to grow up and take responsibility. I hope your mom is doing better. Take care of yourself.
New Leaf
Well-Known Member
HI Earth,
I gave my daughter the name Tornado and her boyfriend Volcano after the song, because their relationship was so full of turmoil and violence. My poor grands. They were in a battleground. Thank you for sharing your story. I am hoping that Tornado will have a chance to wake up in there, but there is the fear in the back of my mimd that she will dive deeper. I have not spoken with her since that first call, she has been trying to call since. From what I have read, meth cravings are horrible and the brain goes through a rough ride with depression. I have decided to put my card on the phone system and try to speak with her, but if she gets belligerent, I will hang up.
Mom is a bit better, home, but still not out of the woods. Thank you so much for your kind words.
(((HUGS)))
Leafy
I gave my daughter the name Tornado and her boyfriend Volcano after the song, because their relationship was so full of turmoil and violence. My poor grands. They were in a battleground. Thank you for sharing your story. I am hoping that Tornado will have a chance to wake up in there, but there is the fear in the back of my mimd that she will dive deeper. I have not spoken with her since that first call, she has been trying to call since. From what I have read, meth cravings are horrible and the brain goes through a rough ride with depression. I have decided to put my card on the phone system and try to speak with her, but if she gets belligerent, I will hang up.
Mom is a bit better, home, but still not out of the woods. Thank you so much for your kind words.
(((HUGS)))
Leafy
New Leaf
Well-Known Member
Well it has been about a month since Tornado has been in jail. I had decided to try and talk with her, but got into a jam with the phone system, credit card stopped the transaction (fraud alert) and I attempted too many times to input, called the number and the fellow said that I would be blocked for ten days. It is a bit frustrating, tried a different card to no avail. Hoku said “maybe it’s the universe
talking Mom!”
I will write her, but screen and edit before I send it. She calls almost daily, but I have no way of picking up. She has written to her children, two of whom have been visiting. They have their shields up, but I can see the yearning beneath the anger and sadness, disbelief and whatever else is going on when one is abandoned by their parents for drugs.
I imagine their is a lot stuffed down, but they are for the most part, doing well.
I have perused websites on how to write to an addicted love one. I don't want to write anything to send her over the edge. I think I will just keep it simple. Tell her that I love her and hope for her to get her head clear while she is in there.
Hope without expectations.
Only time will tell where this will go. Lots of prayers for her to wake up, but that is truly up to her.
Thank you all for your loving words of support, it means a lot to me.
(((Hugs)))
Leafy
talking Mom!”
I will write her, but screen and edit before I send it. She calls almost daily, but I have no way of picking up. She has written to her children, two of whom have been visiting. They have their shields up, but I can see the yearning beneath the anger and sadness, disbelief and whatever else is going on when one is abandoned by their parents for drugs.
I imagine their is a lot stuffed down, but they are for the most part, doing well.
I have perused websites on how to write to an addicted love one. I don't want to write anything to send her over the edge. I think I will just keep it simple. Tell her that I love her and hope for her to get her head clear while she is in there.
Hope without expectations.
Only time will tell where this will go. Lots of prayers for her to wake up, but that is truly up to her.
Thank you all for your loving words of support, it means a lot to me.
(((Hugs)))
Leafy
CareTooMuch
Active Member
Leafy, I'm so sorry you are having such a hard time communicating with her, I do think a month is appropriate and it is a great idea to write just to let her know how much you love her. I would keep it simple and then let her make the next move. But all of us in this group know our kids are incredible manipulators, so try not to to put yourself in a situation where your heart gets broken any further Hugs.
EarthIsHard
Member
Leafy, ditto on Care's comments. And I do believe it's the universe and beyond helping you find the right time to communicate with her
Funny how that works!
Funny how that works!BusynMember
Well-Known Member
I also believe the universal divine energy is goi ng to nudge you not only when but if.
I have followed your whole story since you came. It is ok to take heed that the right time may be the time she comes to YOU sincerely asking for help. Talking to a drug addict, as you well know, is pointless.
Very happy Mom is on the mend. That is a blessing!
Light and love!
I have followed your whole story since you came. It is ok to take heed that the right time may be the time she comes to YOU sincerely asking for help. Talking to a drug addict, as you well know, is pointless.
Very happy Mom is on the mend. That is a blessing!
Light and love!
Albatross
Well-Known Member
I'm sorry you haven't been able to speak, Leafy. How frustrating, but maybe Hoku is right -- maybe the universe is saying it's best to keep it simple and with the opportunity to consider and compose your words for now. I'm sure as her head clears out, her emotions are all over the place.
How wonderful that your grands can be with you for a visit. I'm so glad they have the constant of your loving presence right now!
How wonderful that your grands can be with you for a visit. I'm so glad they have the constant of your loving presence right now!
Copabanana
Well-Known Member
I agree with you and everybody else. Give it time. There is no urgency. All she (really) needs to hear from you, you have said in the letter.
She could NOT be in a better place. She will sleep. There are books. A library cart will go by every few days or every week. There are free bibles. (That is what I am doing now. I am reading the bible to deal with anxiety and sadness.) She may find it very hard to deal with her feelings, but really, what choice is there? If she needs to see a therapist, there is one there. She has company. People who understand better than do we, where she is at, and what this process entails. The other inmates.
This is really not about you, New Leaf. Nor is it about your relationship with her.(Except to the extent that for all of us, for each of us, this provokes in us an existential crisis, of near biblical proportions, but that is something different, and you have been handling this masterfully during your years here on the board and in turn helping us, handle our own versions.)
We. You and I. Are in pretty much the same place right now. Trying very hard to not own something that is not ours to take on. They try to rope us in. To make it about us. What we can do. Don't do. Won't do. Will do.
And the horribleness of this is that our mind goes there too. Even when we know better.
I think it was very good to hold back. And when you tried, you were held back. Good.
This is not about you. Or anything you can or should do. That is my mantra, now.
She could NOT be in a better place. She will sleep. There are books. A library cart will go by every few days or every week. There are free bibles. (That is what I am doing now. I am reading the bible to deal with anxiety and sadness.) She may find it very hard to deal with her feelings, but really, what choice is there? If she needs to see a therapist, there is one there. She has company. People who understand better than do we, where she is at, and what this process entails. The other inmates.
This is really not about you, New Leaf. Nor is it about your relationship with her.(Except to the extent that for all of us, for each of us, this provokes in us an existential crisis, of near biblical proportions, but that is something different, and you have been handling this masterfully during your years here on the board and in turn helping us, handle our own versions.)
We. You and I. Are in pretty much the same place right now. Trying very hard to not own something that is not ours to take on. They try to rope us in. To make it about us. What we can do. Don't do. Won't do. Will do.
And the horribleness of this is that our mind goes there too. Even when we know better.
I think it was very good to hold back. And when you tried, you were held back. Good.
This is not about you. Or anything you can or should do. That is my mantra, now.
Last edited:
Kalahou
Well-Known Member
Dear Leafy,
I think writing a short note is a good idea. (I know you have spoken on the phone already to Tornado once, and it was not a happy call.) And as it has been a month, she could probably use a stroke of caring. Just getting a piece of mail in there may bring a calm to her.
_______________
Hello XX ,
This note is a follow up to your phone call last week. I know you have been trying to call. I need to tell you, son, there is nothing more we will do at this time. We will not be doing bail or sponsoring supervised release.
I understand you feel you are in a hard situation. You are going to come through it. Some pono things can happen for you there. If you see nothing important and good for you there, you can change how you see, and find something to make it important, make it good, make a difference - for you or for someone else. You are smart, and know what you need to do for your good.
We always care for you and hope a good life for you. Nothing changes in our lives unless we make changes in ourselves. I am confident you will work it out. Love to you. I wish the best for you as only you can determine your own life.
Aloha, ~~~
P.S. Info items and questions.
· Your children asked about you. I plan to tell them you are in jail but that you are all right and love them.
· Do you want continued correspondence now and then from me? If not, I won’t send. LMK
· I will answer limited phone calls from you, if and when possible. I am getting the GTL set up.
· I leave it to you to work out your mandatory needs there.
____________________________
Nothing about Difficult Children is easy. We never know what to do or how it will come out. Even though my son has made better strides the last 2 years, every day I still have FOG that I need to work our myself. My thoughts, love and prayers are with you, Tita, as you stay onipa'a in this challenge. You are going to be alright.
Ka la hou ....
I think writing a short note is a good idea. (I know you have spoken on the phone already to Tornado once, and it was not a happy call.) And as it has been a month, she could probably use a stroke of caring. Just getting a piece of mail in there may bring a calm to her.
It's hard to know what to write. I looked back to see what I wrote in the first correspondence to my son in jail. I waited until he had called first. I kept the first note ( and even subsequent ones) to my son short / simple / unemotional / trying to make my position clear. Everyone has their own way of how they want to communicate with a Difficult Child. But for what it’s worth, I'll share what I sent to my son in the first letter. It went something like this :
_______________
Hello XX ,
This note is a follow up to your phone call last week. I know you have been trying to call. I need to tell you, son, there is nothing more we will do at this time. We will not be doing bail or sponsoring supervised release.
I understand you feel you are in a hard situation. You are going to come through it. Some pono things can happen for you there. If you see nothing important and good for you there, you can change how you see, and find something to make it important, make it good, make a difference - for you or for someone else. You are smart, and know what you need to do for your good.
We always care for you and hope a good life for you. Nothing changes in our lives unless we make changes in ourselves. I am confident you will work it out. Love to you. I wish the best for you as only you can determine your own life.
Aloha, ~~~
P.S. Info items and questions.
· Your children asked about you. I plan to tell them you are in jail but that you are all right and love them.
· Do you want continued correspondence now and then from me? If not, I won’t send. LMK
· I will answer limited phone calls from you, if and when possible. I am getting the GTL set up.
· I leave it to you to work out your mandatory needs there.
____________________________
Nothing about Difficult Children is easy. We never know what to do or how it will come out. Even though my son has made better strides the last 2 years, every day I still have FOG that I need to work our myself. My thoughts, love and prayers are with you, Tita, as you stay onipa'a in this challenge. You are going to be alright.
Ka la hou ....
